NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

The methods and techniques outlined in The Miracle of New Avatar Power by Geof Gray-Cobb
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johnblend
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#11 » Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:20 pm

I think that Gadiel and GadRiel are different angels

After doing some sleuthing on the intewebs i have found this
Angel Gadiel will help you repair a damaged relationship, maintain a positive outlook, improve your job performance, transform your life, release limiting beliefs, create abundance.

Gadiel is called the most holy of angels. His name means, “God is my wealth”. He is one of several guards of the gate of the south wind. His name has been found inscribed on amulets to ward off evil.

If you are feeling down or victimized by life, Gadiel is the angel to call upon. Before you confront any negative situation, ask for his protection. Gadiel will also help you release any feelings you have after a disagreement with a friend, an unfavorable assessment from a boss, or an argument with a lover.

http://www.keen.com/CommunityServer/UserBlogPosts/Maureen_-_The_Messenger/Angel-Gadiel-will-help-with-relationships--your-outlook--create-abundance-and-more/529384.aspx

So Gadiel is known here as "god is my wealth", also here he is identified with the warding of evil spect used in nap.


Gadreel (Gadriel--Aramaic, "God is my helper") - It was Gadreel who, reputedly, led Eve astray -- which, if true, would make Gadreel rather than Satan the talking serpent and seducer in the Garden of Eden. Like Azazel, Gadreel made man familiar with the weapons of war.

Gadriel - Chief ruling angel of the 5th Heaven in charge of wars among nations. [see Gadreel.] When a prayer ascebds to Heaven, gadriel crowns it, then accompanies it to the 6th Heaven.Galearii are the lowest ranking angels.

http://www.steliart.com/angelology_angel_names_G.html

So here I found that Gadriel is also known as Gadreel "god is my helper", also Gadreel has a distinct diffrerent character than Gadiel.

So if anyone has worked with both or have any insight about the matter it would be nice to hear any insight.

My own feelings about Gadiel goes pretty much along with the description.

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raum215
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#12 » Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:14 pm

johnblend wrote:I think that Gadiel and GadRiel are different angels


They are. Furthermore, their functions are not identical. This refute of your research findings is not a reflection on you. It, in part, will however disprove the claimed translations of these names.

After doing some sleuthing on the intewebs i have found this
Angel Gadiel will help you repair a damaged relationship, maintain a positive outlook, improve your job performance, transform your life, release limiting beliefs, create abundance.

Gadiel is called the most holy of angels. His name means, “God is my wealth”. He is one of several guards of the gate of the south wind. His name has been found inscribed on amulets to ward off evil.


Gadiel in no way means "God is my wealth." This would mean "gad" means wealth and it does not in any way mean that, but it does show a problem with tanslations. Gad means "fortune in judgement." I.e. voting "for you". Evidence, Witness, and Testimony are all contexts of this word. As is Fate. Tawbh, the word for "Good" also is the ancient word for Wealth. Nakis means "wealth", and much later Khalil does. Now, fortune does mean wealth, but not in the way we are using it. This tells me something was lost in translation in the transcribing of the original meaning.

This name essentially *means* "El is my witness." - and it's context is "El shall prove my innocence." This functions as a name of negative confession, i.e. a decry of no-wrong-doing. GDYAL is the proper spelling in Hebrew, with a value of 48. His essence is primarily Mercurial in neoplatonic terms.

It survives in "God as my witness, I am innocent." and other such claims. This name is useful for legal problems or disputes and suspicions. His role in NAP is very appropriate in this light.

Gadreel (Gadriel--Aramaic, "God is my helper") - It was Gadreel who, reputedly, led Eve astray -- which, if true, would make Gadreel rather than Satan the talking serpent and seducer in the Garden of Eden. Like Azazel, Gadreel made man familiar with the weapons of war.


Nope. Helper, assistant, and all the rest. Not the name. Gadreel means "Gadr"-"y"-el - Gadr is "Wall". Literally, Wall-I-God. The word "wall" in this instance is used for "obstacle." Hence, the name is "I am El's Obstacle" and transversely "El is my obstacle." It's context is "I am shut off from god." This is an epithet of an aspect of Azazel, not a different being. He is divided in himself into separate aspect, throughout creation. This is how he is kept from fully manifesting. GDRYAL is the spelling, value 248

Gadriel - Chief ruling angel of the 5th Heaven in charge of wars among nations. [see Gadreel.] When a prayer ascebds to Heaven, gadriel crowns it, then accompanies it to the 6th Heaven.Galearii are the lowest ranking angels.[/quote]
http://www.steliart.com/angelology_angel_names_G.html

the root of this name is Gederah - GDRHAL, this means "Walls of God" and is a reference to the Principality of Judea. It was he who delivered the 5 smooth stones to the future King of Judea. and set the stone in the crown of David, and the black stone wherein his name and reign was ordained.

So here I found that Gadriel is also known as Gadreel "god is my helper", also Gadreel has a distinct diffrerent character than Gadiel.


All three are different - but two are known to each other. Gadreel was once in charge of Gadriel - but Gadriel was not so turned to fall as was Gadreel. There are different stories of this - one being that Gadriel was promoted to a role Gadreel once held, or they are the fallen and exhalted aspects of the same being. Regardless, they all have their different character when called.

So if anyone has worked with both or have any insight about the matter it would be nice to hear any insight.

My own feelings about Gadiel goes pretty much along with the description.


I have worked with all three.

Gadreel GDRYAL feels very spiteful. He regards humans as weak for needing structures and favours the elements bare to be called in, but he seems to have a shadow cast on him from above and to the north. we heard some distant chatter as from a large crowd - but not talking in unison - like a thousand conversations all at once, each with a sense of urgency, calm, or even amusement. he randomly cried out, and flailed, but his feet were rooted to the seal. He is free to hear the joy of the world but cannot partake of it. The Grigori of Enoch are all in some pocket of torment, in some way. It was like when we did not have his attention, he was left to dwell in his misery.

Gadriel GDRHAL - was always looking past us, scouring for trouble. he spoke in a very soft but distracted tone. This was also during a time where things in the middle east were particularly troublesome. I had a friend that when they went to protest cross-border violence in Palestine, he was kidnapped by Hamas. He was held in a building they hopes Israel would hit. We were looking out for our friend (who was there for human rights for Palestine, not pro-Israel at all.)

Gadiel GDYAL - is much more functional for everyday use. I use his services with respect and gratitude. Excellent in legal matters particular where Mercury may fair better than Jupiter. Good for getting people to suspend their suspicion.
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I YHVH do all these things.


BrotherButterball
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#13 » Tue Jun 26, 2012 10:10 pm

I have worked with Gadiel

And Gadriel as they appeared

In Geof Gray Cobbs books.

Was also in contact with the

Author before his passing.

I think they are the same

Being. I have evoked extensively

Over one thousand times.

Both beings have the same feel.

The author concurred with this.

Tim
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johnblend
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#14 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 4:26 am

Nice to see this discussion continuing
@ raum this is one of the reasons i enjoy the forums here, the willingness to share knowledge that is otherwise hard to obtain.

@ BBB ok so GGC did concur with the notion that the angels are the same, hmm

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raum215
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#15 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:39 am

BrotherButterBall,

Respectfully, I do not care what Geof Grey-Cobb said. I never had the pleasure to speak with him, and I can only conclude from what I have seen he was not so dogmatic as to believe he knew it all. I suspect that may be the case with me as well.

I know that the very essence of Angel Magic is the power of Words, in writing and in oration. I would wager I know more about the words in NAP than Geof Gray-Cobb. It has been my experience that no two words bring forth the same power - ever. The slight change of a letter brings another from the multitude - even the changing of a tone. This may not be his experience. I do not need to agree with his every word to respect and regard his material and efforts. At the very least it brings forth a different character of the same being. I have noticed very few spelling variances in NAP but I would not at all say a Angel who is a principality of a tribe and the protection of a people is the same as the watcher that frustrates them.

I have also done thousands of evocations and probably tens of thousands if you count the evocations of multiple beings at once, and the Enochian work I have done. I only speak from experience. Every system I know of, the only people who say spelling doesn't matter are the ones who do not know how to spell. Those who say a name doesn't matter with an extra guttural (like Resh, which is not a dental R) in it don't know the language. What is the difference between cat and cart? Surely, not just an "r." This is the same of Gad and Gadar and Gaderah.
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I YHVH do all these things.


BrotherButterball
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#16 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:09 am

Charles/Raum,

Thank you for stating your opinion.

In my original posting I stated that I believed the beings

from the Mystic Grimoire and the NAP books are/were the same beings.

In my work with these two books I too have evoked angels and demons

thousands of times. I purposely understated my experiences regarding same.

I suspect that your purpose in these postings is to establish some sort of

supremacy regarding your angelic knowledge. Go ahead and knock yourself out.

I am not claiming and nowhere have I claimed to know it all.

Your studies in the etymology of words are very helpful.

However I believe that I know these two grimoires

better than most and better than you.

These books by Geof Gray Cobb have little to nothing to do with Enochian magic.

Now I have enough drama in my life right now and do not need more

with pissing contests regarding the spelling of angelic names and words.

Thank you for playing Sherlock Holmes.

Tim

Late Edit: I read your somewhat degrading comments about Pagans being assholes

and about the Roman empire. I am quite proud of my Italian heritage and found those

comments laughable to say the least. Speaking to this in modern times and looking back,

the Italians are/were responsible for many great works of art, scientists and scientific

discoveries, and for building some fantastic racing and sports cars too.

I should add that I have met many beautiful and lovely Italian women from that area

and tasted delicious Italian food and drink as well.

Tim






raum215 wrote:BrotherButterBall,

Respectfully, I do not care what Geof Grey-Cobb said. I never had the pleasure to speak with him, and I can only conclude from what I have seen he was not so dogmatic as to believe he knew it all. I suspect that may be the case with me as well.

I know that the very essence of Angel Magic is the power of Words, in writing and in oration. I would wager I know more about the words in NAP than Geof Gray-Cobb. It has been my experience that no two words bring forth the same power - ever. The slight change of a letter brings another from the multitude - even the changing of a tone. This may not be his experience. I do not need to agree with his every word to respect and regard his material and efforts. At the very least it brings forth a different character of the same being. I have noticed very few spelling variances in NAP but I would not at all say a Angel who is a principality of a tribe and the protection of a people is the same as the watcher that frustrates them.

I have also done thousands of evocations and probably tens of thousands if you count the evocations of multiple beings at once, and the Enochian work I have done. I only speak from experience. Every system I know of, the only people who say spelling doesn't matter are the ones who do not know how to spell. Those who say a name doesn't matter with an extra guttural (like Resh, which is not a dental R) in it don't know the language. What is the difference between cat and cart? Surely, not just an "r." This is the same of Gad and Gadar and Gaderah.
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youcandomagicthatworks.wordpress.com


BrotherButterball
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#17 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:13 am

johnblend wrote:Nice to see this discussion continuing
@ raum this is one of the reasons i enjoy the forums here, the willingness to share knowledge that is otherwise hard to obtain.

@ BBB ok so GGC did concur with the notion that the angels are the same, hmm


JohnBlend,

In your original research are you quoting from some new age website?

Would be interested to know where you got your information from, hmmm.

Thank you for your input.

Tim
blackanddarkmagickthatworks.wordpress.com

supernaturalmagicklab.wordpress.com

youcandomagicthatworks.wordpress.com

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raum215
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#18 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:36 am

BrotherButterball wrote:Charles/Raum,

Thank you for stating your opinion. In my original posting I stated that I believed the beings from the Mystic Grimoire and the NAP books are/were the same beings.


I was not speaking to or against that possibility. WIthout ever having seen the Mystic Grimoire, I would not say the same. I would not say anything about it, as I have no experience of it.

In my work with these two books I too have evoked angels and demons thousands of times. I purposely understated my experiences regarding same.


Yes, you stated you did so thousands of times, I just followed suit to let you know I was not speaking an untested theory. It was not a pissing contest.

I suspect that your purpose in these postings is to establish some sort of supremacy regarding your angelic knowledge. Go ahead and knock yourself out.


Not at all. I was discounting the notion that the name meanings offered by JohnBlend are inconsistent with actual words that were suggested. I see these alot especially online or in books by people who do not study biblical or proto-biblical languages. It was to that point I was replying. It is not about supremacy, it is about sharing. If someone says a name means something, it should pass a linguistic test, and those do not.

My fundamental approach to magic is simple, words have power and names are words. If a name means something, as it should if appointed, it should be cognate to the function of the being. To this end, I have studied the very essence of linguistics. I have done so since my seventh grade year, some 24 years ago. This was when I first learned how the name of Raphael is derived from the Torah. Even before then, I was interested but how it fit with magic really solidified itself in my late teens. This very premise is essential to Angel Magic, in its oldest forms, and so maybe , just maybe it is a good tenet to practice.

I am not claiming and nowhere have I claimed to know it all.

Your studies in the etymology of words are very helpful.


It is not about if I know it all. It is not about if you know it all. It is about how certain one's working assumptions are and if they are confident enough to entertain speculation and criticism. I know mine are. All magic is based on tenets, "working assumptions" in mathematics. I ironed mine out, and they in general are sound principals found in most magic. My "school" is yellow. It is not about establishing supremacy. My view is generally, lead, follow, or get the hell out of the way. - all of which is determined by the compentency one has with the material, or the latent comprehension. I do not care if I am in charge, I want the BEST person for the job in charge. There is no "I" besides an ever growing body of knowledge and experience.


However I believe that I know these two grimoires better than most and better than you.


I would not doubt that, having that I have not even seen one of them, and heard of both of them this year. My first post said nothing of the book. It was about specific angels. Also, I do not believe the work of ANY one magician, or all in accord is beyond error. I believe the statement "all prophets are true, save that they understand a little." is VERY applicable.

However, I'd wager I may understand them in context you do not, and perhaps even Geof Gray-Cobb did not. One of receiving a Qabala, one of origins of Angel Magic, and one of being proficient in biblical and proto-lingusitics. This doesn't mean other views are not valuable or people do not have their own perspectives, but in general a book with Sanskrit and Hebrew is probabaly more transparent to someone who is familiar with those languages.

These books by Geof Gray Cobb have little to nothing to do with Enochian magic.


I never said they did. I simply was stating they are a part of my considerable experience.

Now I have enough drama in my life right now and do not need more with pissing contests regarding the spelling of angelic names and words.


I did not offer or start a pissing contest. Not sure why you take this so personally, actually.

Thank you for playing Sherlock Holmes.

Tim


REPLY 1, typical of the kind of replies I would like from people when I may offend them.
I am not "playing" - I am not pretending. I do hard research. A person doing 200 pushups and practicing rifle drills with a 12 lb bar is not "playing" soldier. This is very serious to me. I study and practice some three to seven hours a day. It is not because I am playing, it is because this is part of my passion for being alive, and for me a huge part of that passion is language. Language allows for reason in magic - it constitutes one large aspect of "To Know."

REPLY 2, typical of the kind of replies I get when people get offended. :lol:
You are laughable, clearly you mean I am not serious and I hate you. Sherlock Holmes did not play, well maybe the violin, but I do not. So clearly, you are making fun of me for not playing the violin! Not everyone who can fingure things out needs to play the violin and works for scotland yard. I'll have you know the Scots are not all bad. They made schotch whiskey and golf.

-----

Until after the Dark Ages subsided, most magicians were not using languages they did not understand. That was the product of millions of deaths following the redaction of cultures into kingdoms as Rome, the Empire not the City, fell. Before that, many lost their culture as it was forcibly integrated and subdued under Roman, not Italian, rule.

It's not like Rome was the only one to do this, or all of Rome is Italy. but it is sort of sad that I have to mention that.


----


BTW- I do not hate Italy, Rome, Italia, or any of the rest. If you found what I said laughable, you did not read what I intended. For one, Rome and Italy are not the same. What I do not understand is why that was brought up here in this thread.
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I YHVH do all these things.

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johnblend
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#19 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:46 am

BrotherButterball wrote:
johnblend wrote:Nice to see this discussion continuing
@ raum this is one of the reasons i enjoy the forums here, the willingness to share knowledge that is otherwise hard to obtain.

@ BBB ok so GGC did concur with the notion that the angels are the same, hmm


JohnBlend,

In your original research are you quoting from some new age website?

Would be interested to know where you got your information from, hmmm.

Thank you for your input.

Tim


Hi there, yes the info gathered was from a " new agey" website, link to it was provided in my post. I was quoting a part of the text that was originally from "The Encyclopedia of Angels by Susan Gregg"
http://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Angels-Spirit-Ascended-Masters/dp/1592333435
Even though the source might be "new agey" I am not ready to throw the baby out with the bathwater.

taken from the same source as the info on gadriel in my post above- http://www.steliart.com/angelology_angel_names_G.html
Gadiel - A "most holy angel" involked in goetic operations, as directed in Mathers, The Greater Key of Solomon, Gadiel is a resident of the 5th Heaven. Gadiel is one of numerous angelic guards of the gates of the South Wind. The fact that Gadiel's name is found inscribed on an oriental charm (kamea) suggests that he must have been regarded as a power to protect the wearer against evil.


Gadiel According to this is a "resident" in the 5th heaven (what i interpret as the sphere of gebura) Gadriel according to the same sourcse is "the chief ruling angel" of the fifth heaven. Might be a clue why there are similarities between them.


What sparked my interest in this discussion, was the suprise that the feeling of working with Gadiel was more loving and uplifting than I expected. Not that martian/ geburah feel that i expected.

interesting discussion and I thank you for your input.

/john

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raum215
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Re: NAP Gadiel Invocation and Seal of Authority

Post#20 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:05 am

The fifth heaven is where the hells are found, at their core. between walls. - this is the whole notion of the linguistics.

There is that "walled off from God" (GDRIAL). There is that which is not imprisoned in the walls, "witnessed for innocence when "Judged by God" (GDYAL), and there is the "walls of God" (GDRHAL) which create the division.
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I YHVH do all these things.

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