middle pillar and bornless invocation

The methods and techniques outlined in The Miracle of New Avatar Power by Geof Gray-Cobb
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Gilbertopb
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#21 » Sun Nov 09, 2014 8:12 pm

I AM wrote:It has been my experience that the two practices do not mix well together. In chakra balancing, the energy flows from below to the top, but in the middle pillar the energy flows from the top down. When I've tried to introduce chakras into the middle pillar it seems to create blockages where the introduced chakras are. The flow stops flowing. Just my experience, but whatever works for you.



Most probably the problem is because the mix of practices. Two recipes can be very good, but won't work at the same time.

About the chakras, we can have many descriptions and images of how the flow of energy happens.
If you imagine the circulation power like a water pipe, where flow occurs only in one direction, certainly a lock or attempt to push water while in the opposite direction will not work.

Each chakra is a point of entry and exit at various levels of the various subtle bodies at the same time. Therefore one of the images we have is the energy spiral (actually, multiple spirals).
Imagine an ideal situation where multiple intertwined spirals rotate, but going in and out at the same time in harmony (this is the ideal). And also, circling the base to the top and vice versa.
See this images as example:

Image

Image

I think it would be more appropriate to think just how energy entering and exiting.
Blockages occur when the energy is not flowing. Like there was a lid or by the difference in force between them.
And this is also affected by your intention, your thoughts and the type of practice being made.

If you do not realize that the chakras path has multiple directions, or mix different practices with different "intentions", the energy will circulate in a conflicting manner and therefore the result is not expected.

This is just one of the ways in which the mixture of different practices can lead to unexpected results.

In any case, think of the way of the chakras just like a highway from multiple directions and with multiple inputs and outputs.

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amind
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#22 » Sat Dec 30, 2017 4:57 pm

Sorry for resurrecting such an old thread. But I must ask, what does he mean by "(Make Sign of the Sun and Moon Conjoined.)"

Is it meant that one draws the sigil of sun and moon conjoined? Give the signs of NOX? Or is there a sign I haven't been able to find. A little confused.

EDIT: Found it it means to draw the mark of the beast. Which is the sigil of the sun and moon atop each other.

The only thing remaining that has been quite cryptic, is the phrase "return to the square of tiphareth."
I think this might be symbolic.


Ironchakra1
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#23 » Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:05 am

I have done chakra meditation work and middle pillar exercise back to back. But not mixed together in the same session. It felt good but hard to relate a subjective experience into words, for me.

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Brother_Moloch_969
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#24 » Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:52 am

If I may...

NAP does not need the full on "Bornless Rite" from Crowley, G.D. or anywhere else. This ritual is overkill for what the spirits of this system are required to react and respond to. Save that for your Crowleyite practices. The ritual given in the text is the Headless One not the Bornless One and it is a very shortened form of the original fragment those old English geezers invented. There's no use for the elemental portions and one does not need to go through lines of verbiage for no reason other than to satisfy one's ego that you memorized it and now have to use it in every ceremony sort of like the novice guitarist who learns how to use his whammy bar so now he HAS to use it every time he plays anything. Ugh. Be judicious where and when you use such a thing.

The Central Pillar as Gray-Cobb refers to the Middle Pillar charges one's Power Gates pp. 134-135. He doesn't even refer to them as either Chakras NOR Sephira so both of you are incorrect. He simply refers to them as POWER GATES.
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Bersagliere81
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#25 » Fri Mar 30, 2018 3:52 pm

Brother_Moloch_969 wrote:If I may...
He simply refers to them as POWER GATES.


Thank you for your clarifycation.
I read (I think it was on magemagic blog?) that some of the NAP Spirits are actually "inner forces" and not real Spirits.
This is the very first thing that came in my head, could this be the reason that Gray-Cobb made such statement?

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Brother_Moloch_969
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#26 » Tue May 08, 2018 12:44 pm

Bersagliere81 wrote:Thank you for your clarifycation.


Welcome.

Bersagliere81 wrote:I read (I think it was on magemagic blog?) that some of the NAP Spirits are actually "inner forces" and not real Spirits. This is the very first thing that came in my head, could this be the reason that Gray-Cobb made such statement?


You're welcome to believe that if such is your wont however that's an approach I find ridiculous since it's a psychological approach that refers all magic happens in your head. To pub it bluntly, "fuck that nonsense". Psychology is a field of as much hokum as the occult offers and I find it amusing that otherwise highly intelligent people put much stock into it yet they will harp on Jung for hours if you allow them to do so. Meh. I'll tell you like I do anyone else, if you wish to take that tact, then may I suggest giving up the occult and pursuing a Ph.D in Psychology instead? That way you're not fiddling around with esoteric nonsense and instead pursuing everything in a clinically bland, arrogant, know-it-all fashion where every idea, belief and feeling is labeled, objectified and reduced to a mental disorder - so your insurance company will pay for the therapy.

However if you ignore that ridiculous nonsense and instead take the tact that the NAP spirits are real, treat Them as such, and press on, you should be able to get decent results in a modicum amount of time.
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Silenciumetaurum
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#27 » Fri May 11, 2018 6:14 am

Brother_Moloch_969 wrote:[font=Verdana]The ritual given in the text is the Headless One not the Bornless One and it is a very shortened form of the original fragment those old English geezers invented.


Between the Liber Samekh version, various non-Crowley translations (of varying quality) of the Stele of Jeu, and Gray-Cobb's short version, I really like Gray-Cobb's above all the others. I'm sure people will get upset at me for saying this, but the NAP version makes me feel empowered. The more authentic version (as I mention here:
http://www.studioarcanis.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=16326) had beneficial effects but was also highly unpleasant and messed me up for a while. And the last time I performed the full Liber Samekh, horrible things happened in my life shortly thereafter. I'm not so sure about the utility of that one.

It would be crazy to hang my past troubles solely on the performance of a ritual. However, I can say that I was living in Paris when I did the version presented in Gordon White's Chaos Protocols and my entire experience in the city took a massive turn for the worse. I lost the client (in my mundane job) who had brought me there. I had to move to a nasty basement apartment on short notice (since I was scheduled to be in Paris for up to a year). I got a really bad 3-week cold. There were some unpleasant family issues back in the USA blowing up my email in a way that gave me no rest. And I was suddenly forced to confront a lot of other problems in my life that I had been ignoring. I'm used to my magic feeling good, improving things pretty quickly, and teaching me in the process. This felt like hell, improved things slowly and at great cost, and did teach me things I needed to learn but in the most painful ways.

So ultimately, it was good medicine. And it really did do what it is supposed to do (according to some authorities) by triggering a kind of internal initiation experience. I needed that on the highest levels, but I didn't need the grief that came with it (as if those two could have been separated). Still, the more authentic PGM version is not something I intend to do more than once every couple years, if that. I invoke the NAP version almost every day and, even though it has a much smaller effect, it's more useful to me in the long run as an empowerment than a big cathartic ritual that will break things open and force me onto new paths. The big medicine should not be taken lightly.
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WolfAmongSheep
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#28 » Fri May 11, 2018 6:54 pm

Silenciumetaurum wrote:
Between the Liber Samekh version, various non-Crowley translations (of varying quality) of the Stele of Jeu, and Gray-Cobb's short version, I really like Gray-Cobb's above all the others. I'm sure people will get upset at me for saying this, but the NAP version makes me feel empowered.

The more authentic version (as I mention here:
http://www.studioarcanis.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=16326) had beneficial effects but was also highly unpleasant and messed me up for a while. And the last time I performed the full Liber Samekh, horrible things happened in my life shortly thereafter. I'm not so sure about the utility of that one.


The NAP version works really well for a lot of people, including me. I tried the full version that was recorded by Regardie, for a week. I started feeling angry at the beginning, then it progressed to absolute rage, by day 3 or 4, then continued further into some really dark places. I had to stop and lock myself in the house for a few days in order to recover. It was not pretty.

I have talked to a couple other practitioners that tried the full version of it, be it Regardies, Crowleys, etc., and they reported similar anger issues. I am still not sure why I got that response, but I haven't rechallenged doing the full ritual to see if I get the same results, because Cobbs version works. As always, YMMV.
Of the Seven Deadly Sins, Lust is definitely the pick of the litter ~ Anon

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Pablo
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#29 » Sat May 12, 2018 3:29 am

For those who experienced anger here is a question.

(With that wonderful thing call hindsight) was the anger long standing but repressed or was it a new sensitivity and irritation?
I ask because I have seen anger erupt from yoga which makes me think of muscle memories as discussed by Wilhelm Reich.

Rgds

Pablo
The vulgar is at everyone's command. Eirenaeus Philalethes - The marrow of Alchemy

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Brother_Moloch_969
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Re: middle pillar and bornless invocation

Post#30 » Fri May 25, 2018 7:22 pm

Silenciumetaurum wrote:It would be crazy to hang my past troubles solely on the performance of a ritual.


*shrugs* I would tend to agree with you on this however I have known a few whose lives were otherwise okay then they did X and boom the proverbial hit the fan. So you take it as you see it or in this case prefer to believe it.

Silenciumetaurum wrote:However, I can say that I was living in Paris when I did the version presented in Gordon White's Chaos Protocols and my entire experience in the city took a massive turn for the worse. I lost the client (in my mundane job) who had brought me there. I had to move to a nasty basement apartment on short notice (since I was scheduled to be in Paris for up to a year). I got a really bad 3-week cold. There were some unpleasant family issues back in the USA blowing up my email in a way that gave me no rest. And I was suddenly forced to confront a lot of other problems in my life that I had been ignoring. I'm used to my magic feeling good, improving things pretty quickly, and teaching me in the process. This felt like hell, improved things slowly and at great cost, and did teach me things I needed to learn but in the most painful ways.


Holy Hand Grenades, Batman! Sorry to hear about the ton of crap that hit the fan on you, man. That had suck big time. Especially with the 3 week cold to just ad spite to the misery? Yeesh!

Silenciumetaurum wrote:So ultimately, it was good medicine. And it really did do what it is supposed to do (according to some authorities) by triggering a kind of internal initiation experience. I needed that on the highest levels, but I didn't need the grief that came with it (as if those two could have been separated). Still, the more authentic PGM version is not something I intend to do more than once every couple years, if that.


I performed the Liber Samekh full on right out of Crowley's book and it did absolutely squat. Not a damn thing happened. I was so disappointed. Bill Heidrick had told people how powerful this ritual was and it did etc, etc, yadda, yadda. So I thought in 1997, give it a try! Never hurts to shake up a world or three, right? I had hoped something would happen. Then later I think it was someone on Lorne Waddell's old Ritual Magic list in Yahoo Group's posted the Headless Rite from the PGM but I cannot remember who. That looked interesting. Thus I gave it a shot. Not even my hair stirred. Soooo I decided to try something with a wee bit more panache. I worked at a place that was built on old Native lands and it was an oddly shaped building which was also allegedly haunted by ghosts and spirits though I never experienced any. Our bathrooms were tiled floors and walls so sound just reverberated. We had 24/7 access to the building and I was friends with the night watchman, Ted, who was a former science teacher yet he had experienced ghosts first hand so he was now a believer and Ted knew about my occult views. So I told Ted if he heard any chanting or noises coming from the men's bathroom on the upstairs level that it was me not some spirit. ;)

I vibrated the PGM's Headless One ritual and gods DAMN that set the hairs on the back of my neck on end! I had goose bumps on top of my skin, and I had a distinct feeling something was in the room with me but I didn't know what. Was I scared? Well yes to some degree yet I was fighting to remain actively in control mainly because I didn't know what IT was nor did IT really know WHO I was either. So I thought for a moment and remembered what an old Santero told me, "If a spirit shows up during a ritual that you didn't summon, give it a task and send it on it's way!" And that's what I did. I told it to go and do such and such by the next full moon (which was the end of the week) and immediately, like a balloon that popped, the feeling was gone. I was alone. I was sweating, breathing heavy and had not realized I was in this predicament. Oh I had my normal occult ritual accouterments with me such as my power bag and my staff but other than that, nothing. Didn't even draw a circle because at this time I wasn't using circles any longer as I figured if you're gonna run with the big dogs, you best learn to run with them.

In the short, the spirit did what it was told and believe it or not, IT came back to me a week or so after that. IT stopped outside the door of my office but would not enter for some odd reason. Someone had been murdered in this building in 1958 but not in my office that much I knew. So whatever IT was, IT seemed to be interested in me while I was still there. Once I left, I never felt ITs presence after.

My theory is that you need to find the key to unlock how a ritual affects you and when you do, be ready to give orders and snap attention. Because boy howdy there's nothing like it. I had shivers down my spine telling my wife and my best friend/student Vinny about it the next day. Something to be said for doing rituals in haunted places, eh?

Silenciumetaurum wrote:I invoke the NAP version almost every day and, even though it has a much smaller effect, it's more useful to me in the long run as an empowerment than a big cathartic ritual that will break things open and force me onto new paths. The big medicine should not be taken lightly.


Actually I think the NAP version is merely a reminder to the operator's higher self as well as the spirits s/he summons that you are in command and They need to pay heed for the time being. I don't believe Geoff intended for it to be anything other than that. I don't recommend folks to use it in place of the full on Headless One rite and I definitely do NOT recommend Liber Samekh which I find to be utterly and ridiculously useless.

Your mileage may vary.
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