(My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

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Pablo
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Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#11 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:41 am

summerland wrote:I asked Elubatel why i feel depression after i summon him...He said it is of my own self image that what i ask of him i subconsciously feel that it will fail.... So yes i guess it is of my own self destruction that i sabotage myself. He also noted that he doesnt have emotions therefore success can be given whether pain can be endured to achieve my goal. He has no concept of human feelings.

Interesting thou....He has no concept of time either... His words are take 2 seconds and split them apart between the past and the present...This is the energy that surrounds him. His time frame is in the now which might be to us days or hours or weeks


:goodpost
But stating "Good Post" is not really enough. You have defined what is is to be an angel (or demon) to a tee in a very concise manner. Here is the one constant that we have in magic which is the constant clash between human expectations and angelic or demonic action. Left to me I would make your post a Sticky for the newbies. With out getting into your Business May I ask "If you could re do it what would you do better?". I would guess it would be to plan for success better A good plan does help things along nicer. but the wrong plan will not. But I would like to understand your thoughts as you went through the process.
A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes. Mark Twain

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talerman
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Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#12 » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:51 am

summerland wrote: His time frame is in the now which might be to us days or hours or weeks


When you say now, I guess it is less than a sec. Non-time at all. But probably this is also which makes one eternal. Some spirits are like that, we are not. Well, what we are expected to experience in our life-time, maybe it all can happen in one day only...but that is why we have life - to extend all what we are about to experience maximally...
Enigma et Paradigma

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summerland
Adeptus Exemptus
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Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#13 » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:08 pm

Pablo wrote:
summerland wrote:I asked Elubatel why i feel depression after i summon him...He said it is of my own self image that what i ask of him i subconsciously feel that it will fail.... So yes i guess it is of my own self destruction that i sabotage myself. He also noted that he doesnt have emotions therefore success can be given whether pain can be endured to achieve my goal. He has no concept of human feelings.

Interesting thou....He has no concept of time either... His words are take 2 seconds and split them apart between the past and the present...This is the energy that surrounds him. His time frame is in the now which might be to us days or hours or weeks


:goodpost
But stating "Good Post" is not really enough. You have defined what is is to be an angel (or demon) to a tee in a very concise manner. Here is the one constant that we have in magic which is the constant clash between human expectations and angelic or demonic action. Left to me I would make your post a Sticky for the newbies. With out getting into your Business May I ask "If you could re do it what would you do better?". I would guess it would be to plan for success better A good plan does help things along nicer. but the wrong plan will not. But I would like to understand your thoughts as you went through the process.


Thank you Pablo!... Yes a better plan for success... Think of Elubatel as a strictly business man. He wants all the details down to the tee... So yes bring a proposal and how you want to implement it if it is a business sort of deal. And how you want it to play out. He has never been human so he knows nothing of emotions whether good or bad. Because he has no idea of time ask him to be subtle (gradual) with what you want. He really doesnt give a rip if you try to explain that you are human and to be gentle and not turn your world upside down.
"Ni neart go cur le cheile "


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NoxLumina
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Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#14 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:40 pm

Could the depression be part of it and a necessary tool? Maybe we need to work through those feelings?

Suicidal ideation - which I never experienced before in my life - came about as part of my own success working.

Thankfully I have friends, a partner, and a cat as my anchor. I also recognized it for the opportunity that it was. I got through it, but the suicidal feelings were telling me something - and at the end of it, they were my teacher. I knew what my real purpose was, because without living it, I wouldn't find life worth living. I feel much closer to my authentic self since that discovery and it renewed my commitment to the path I'm on. I also ended up even closer to my gods and spirits, who got me through it.

When I pivoted my thinking to "alright, what would make me want to live," I had a crystal clear magical objective and a vision for my life direction.

Maybe we try to run from feelings when part of magic is dealing with the difficult ones.

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My Magickal Blog: Three Worlds Magick

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CosmicLatte
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Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#15 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:07 pm

Aye. A sink or swim situation. A necessary refinement that brings one closer in achieving one's goals.

Reminds me of Job 23:10 -

But he knoweth the way that I take: when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.

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summerland
Adeptus Exemptus
Posts: 2150

Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#16 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:59 pm

NoxLumina wrote:Could the depression be part of it and a necessary tool? Maybe we need to work through those feelings?

Suicidal ideation - which I never experienced before in my life - came about as part of my own success working.

Thankfully I have friends, a partner, and a cat as my anchor. I also recognized it for the opportunity that it was. I got through it, but the suicidal feelings were telling me something - and at the end of it, they were my teacher. I knew what my real purpose was, because without living it, I wouldn't find life worth living. I feel much closer to my authentic self since that discovery and it renewed my commitment to the path I'm on. I also ended up even closer to my gods and spirits, who got me through it.

When I pivoted my thinking to "alright, what would make me want to live," I had a crystal clear magical objective and a vision for my life direction.

Maybe we try to run from feelings when part of magic is dealing with the difficult ones.

Sent from my SM-G550T using Tapatalk


Im not wanting to kill myself......
"Ni neart go cur le cheile "

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Rova
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Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#17 » Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:23 am

I've done my first work with Elubatel recently following the instructions on the NAP book. She (because thats how she appeared for me if you think shes a guy then sure I dont think s/he cares).
I do think she is quite spectacular on her work... I've been working with her in the simple ritual for three days and I am really new to practical magic this is my second time doing it, and I sure feel a change. My goal had not been fulfilled yet nor is there anything relating to my goal happening but I do feel an energetic change and sometimes it makes me feel like a floating balloon...?
I also experienced the depression. I think it's her because I was having thoughts I've never had before and was thinking that out of nowhere. They come in like waves. The depression comes in and ends within 3 hours or so. They feel like a more spiritual and dramatic version of period mood swings.....? I do agree it feels like a different type of depression.

My thought on Elubatel's negative effects is that there were supposed to be grindstones you need to go around before you achieve your goal normally, but because Elubatel is "bending the laws of cosmos to my and thy will" its like you are flying through these difficulties that was meant for you and reaching to the final destination and maybe your depression is just the feelings attached to flying through the difficulties that you were supposed to go through?Just my two cents.

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Pablo
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Re: (My thoughts on) Elubatel's negative effects

Post#18 » Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:51 am

I wonder where is Elubatel on the ToL? I wonder if he would fit on Binah due to the (possible) Saturnine qualities / attributes assigned to him. I wonder also if the depression has to do with the mountain that must climbed or the amount of work ( possibly painful) that needs to be done to achieve the results.

Just thinking out loud.

I should also add that my encounters with Elubatel have not led to depression but then I am a naturally Saturnine type as I have a Capricorn ascendant and my natal Saturn is 1 degree of Capricorn.
A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes. Mark Twain

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